Intangible Podcast
Welcome to the Intangible Podcast. We sit with professional athletes, coaches and experts to uncover the intangible qualities that drive peak performance. Through our conversations we discover the strategies, mindset shifts, and hidden strengths that elevate athletes to new heights.
Intangible Podcast
Richie James | 7th Round Pick to Super Bowl Champion
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What does it really take to go from the projects to becoming a Super Bowl Champion?
On this episode of the Intangible Podcast, we sit down with NFL wide receiver and Super Bowl champion Richie James to break down the mindset, discipline, and unseen traits that helped him beat the odds and stay in the league.
From growing up in Sarasota with limited structure to becoming a standout at Middle Tennessee State and eventually carving out a role in the NFL with the San Francisco 49ers, New York Giants, and Kansas City Chiefs — Richie’s story is packed with lessons every young athlete needs to hear.
We dive into what it means to be a 7th round draft pick fighting for your spot, how embracing roles like special teams can extend your career, and why loving the game matters more than chasing money. Richie also opens up about the reality of transitioning out of football and the identity shift many athletes face.
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All right guys, welcome back to the Nintendo Podcast. I'm excited to have a conversation with my guy Richie James. You're a Super Bowl champion with the Kansas City Chiefs. I mean, I missed it by by this much, winning the Super Bowl when I played, man. So I hope you're making sure you you keep that ring in a trophy, looking at it from time to time, remembering what you've done, because uh that's a special, that's a special thing. It's hard to do, and I never got back there. So uh, but also you were drafted by the drafted by the San Francisco 49ers, seven-round draft pick. Uh you played for the 49ers, the Giants and Chiefs. Um, you had a career year with the Giants um with um with 57 catches, 569 yards, four touchdowns, uh, middle Tennessee standout wide receiver, known for your versatility, not just as a receiver, but as a uh return specialist, uh, which I'm looking forward to really diving into. Um welcome to the Tangible Podcast, my friend.
SPEAKER_02Hey. I'm glad I'm here.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, man. It's always fun to kind of look back over guys' careers, man, because I know for a lot of us it's hard for us to kind of go back there and look at it because we're just kind of keeping our eyes forward on what's the next thing. But I think it's always important to remember, you know, what we've done, you know, hear from somebody else and be like, okay, all right, you know, and those are the things that continue to fuel you to those next stages of life. So uh really excited to have you all, man. You know, as I tell everyone we jump on this podcast, per purpose of this podcast is to talk about these intangibles, these things that have made us who we are, so that we can start to share our experiences with younger athletes and parents because we've been there, we've done that, and how we've how we've now, you know, used that foundation, not just for sports, but transitioning those things into different parts of life, uh, whether that's been a father, uh, been a been a brother, son, uh, and whether whether you're working in as an entrepreneur or working for a company, um, those that foundation is is transferable. So before we get into all of that, man, I want to I want you to kind of jump in and take us back to growing up in Sarasota, what was that like? Um, childhood with your family, you know, I like to start with that early upbringing.
SPEAKER_02Um it was it was fun, man. Um it was interesting because uh, you know, the fact that, you know, I grew up in the project. So uh, you know, everything we did was it was outdoors. Um everything, you know, from you know, jumping on the trains, jumping on moving trains like that, yeah, just trying to explore and be free. Um, you know, the only time you go in the house is when the street lights come on. So uh that was just the life of just growing up in the projects and you know, playing football on a big field, as we call it. Um, you know, um yeah, man, it was it was a lot going on, riding bites, uh just outside and just trying to explore and just you know see what the world you know offers. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Did you grow up with siblings that, you know, uh was your mom strict, dad, you know, like you know, take us through your your upbringing there with your family and and and how did that kind of structure or or or lack of structure kind of get you into football?
SPEAKER_02Um yeah, so I grew up in the household with one sibling. Um, but you know, my dad had kids outside of uh my mom. Um so you know, so we had about five of us, I believe. It's like five of us total. Um, so you know, growing up with them, I kind of was always outside. They kind of let me run free and you know, do what I need to do and kind of grow up a little bit. And so the structure, I wouldn't say it was there, but it was there, but it wasn't there, you know what I'm saying? In the sense of like I can kind of do what I want to do, and I kind of had the discipline to you know figure out where I need to be and where I shouldn't be, you know. Yeah, so um, yeah, I don't know, family structure is a little different when I was growing up, at least you know, because I lived in a I lived in a project, so it was just like we can't go too far anyways.
SPEAKER_03Right, right. Yeah, I know what that's like. Now, uh, when did you start to get into football? You know, what age, and then when did you realize that football could be something that can take you somewhere?
SPEAKER_02I've been playing football since I was five. And I mean, it started in the big field, we call it big field. It's it usually it was a to me, it was a 100-yard field, but I don't know how big it was because when I got older, they tore it down. You know, they tore the projects down and built some new ones. So I don't know how big the field was, but we call it the big field. That's where everybody, hey man, I'm gonna play football in a big field. So um I it started in the big field, but like I don't know how big this field was. It's probably like maybe like 50 yards or whatever or so. And that's my love for it started, I would say.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_02And you know, just playing with older kids, and you know, hey man, I want to play with him, bro. Hey, uh there, nice, you know, they say right there, nice, you know what I'm saying? So uh, you know, just getting recruited by the older kids, that's when you started getting the love, you know, fell in that love with the you know, making the older dude miss, you're like, oh okay, I okay. Oh hey, he he he hard, bro. He's wrong, he's wrong. Um, but no, he's been playing since I was five, though, you know, just yeah, every single time.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, nice. And when when did you realize that football could be something that can get you out of the projects and take you to um give you give you some some different exposure in life?
SPEAKER_02To be honest with you, I didn't know until my junior year of high school.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Uh it took me to my coach, my high school coach, to say, you know, you can get a scholarship to play at the next level. And uh I played C Double A, you know, growing up a little bit, but I didn't know how to get there. I didn't know about college. Um a lot of people in my family didn't go to college, so like no one was telling me, hey, this is what you can do, this is what you can't do. And I just love playing football. I just I didn't think any much of it, you know. I just I just want to play football, you know. So um, you know, my coach is like, hey, if you keep doing what you're doing, you got good grades, somebody's gonna recruit you. You know what I'm saying? That's how you go to the next level, they give you free, you know, pretty much free everything. Room board. So I'm like, oh, okay, well, we ain't really got it like that.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_02So I'm trying to get it like that. Yeah. So, you know, what can I do? So I discarded, I started like, you know, going harder, you know.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. And so so when you start to when you start to go hard, you know, at what point in your your high school career you start to get noticed by these schools, you know, and and then once you start to get noticed, what made you, what made you decide to come to middle Tennessee, middle Tennessee State?
SPEAKER_02I did get an offering to my senior high school. And um, you know, I had coaches tell me, you know, hey, film, you need to show us some film, like, you know, you run a routes. Um, and I'm like, okay, you know, so I had my coaches or you know, players that was with me film me running routes and send it to these schools, and you know, they didn't even offer me. Uh, but I was out there six o'clock in the morning trying to run these routes and you know what I'm saying, trying to get this film out to these coaches and whatever. Uh, but that didn't happen. And then Coach Stock out of Middle Tennessee, you know, eventually came around. And from my you know, remembering, like, he's for some reason he was always stuck in my head through the whole process. But like from my memory, he came around like, and he was just like, Yeah, you're gonna be a Middle Tennessee state group Raiders. I'm like, all right, okay, I hear you, Coach, but I'm committed to Georgia Southern now, you know what I'm saying? I don't yeah, I'm committed to George Southern right now. At this point, I'm committed to Georgia Southern for corner. And um at this point, I'm like, yeah, I'm going to Georgia Southern. They just beat Florida. Matt Britt is there, you know what I'm saying? Jack McKinnon is there. These guys who I end up playing with in the league anyways, but um, they there. I end up going on official visit there and everything. So I'm like, I'm I'm all in on Georgia Southern. Like, uh, and you know, Florida kid, why not go to Georgia? It's right there. So, you know, it's somewhere through the process, you know, Coach Stock was just saying, like, hey, look, man, just come to Middle Tennessee and see what happens. So I ended up going to Middle Tennessee. Went up there, loved it, enjoyed my visit, came back home and said, Yeah, I gotta, I gotta go to the middle of Tennessee. I end up going to Middle Tennessee, yeah. It was on.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Did you ever think getting to Middle Tennessee that you would become the go-to receiver? Or were you just, did you just have your head down, just like I just need to get there, and then I'll figure it out when I get there? Or did you did you have a game plan on the front end? When I get there, this is what I want to do.
SPEAKER_02Well, um they were recruiting me as an athlete, so I didn't know what I was gonna do when I got there. Um, but I figured to myself, like, since I didn't want to go play corner at Georgia Southern, I was gonna play somewhere on offense. Um and I played running back all my life pretty much until I got to high school because I was way too small. I was what 4'9, 95 pounds. Like I was way too small to be trying to play running back in high school. So they moved me to slot. That was like the only position that can really like save me and you know, still get a chance to get the ball in my hands. Um but when I got in the middle of Tennessee, I I just went crazy throughout the spring and all that stuff. And um, I just remember like nobody can just, nobody can really tackle me. You know what I'm saying? And back then they were getting physical, like, so like we're going head up, you know, whatever in college, you know what I'm saying? Oh, you know, tackle Joe's in college, but I was just I was making everybody miss. But I just I was behind a senior at the time, and you know, Coach Stock was like, yo, um, we we gonna need you for four years, you know what I'm saying? Um, so we're gonna have to research you. So I'm like, dang, hey. I just remember going back to my dorm and just crying. Like at the time, I was like, yeah, you know, all right, coach, I got you. But I remember going back to my dorm and like, man, I gotta sit out for a year, man. This is crazy, man. I came over here, I did everything I needed to do to play, dah, but um, I know how to red shirt. And then it was like, yeah, we're gonna need you. But I'm the playing receiver, uh, they end up with my receiver. Um, but I played anything they wanted me to play.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_02Running back, quarterback, whatever.
SPEAKER_03Do you feel like red shirting prolonged your career? Did you feel like it it got you ready to compete, to be to be the go-to guy?
SPEAKER_02Honestly, I think I should have played right away, but I understood, you know, how it went. But I, you know how, you know, as a as a young dude, like you kind of don't you just get in there, you don't want to step on nobody's toes, but you know, at the same time, I wanted to find it, like, man, I can't believe this. I don't want to rush her. I think I'm better than this guy, whoever this guy is. Like, I don't put it, whoever, you know what I'm saying? But I think it took me a I think I was ready. But yeah, you know, the way the game goes, they had a senior in front of me. You know, I had somebody that was that been there for in the program for a while, you know what I'm saying? So um, you know, and that was respect. You know, it's like, all right, well, if I was a senior I've been there for a long time and this young guy come in and just they just gave him my spot, I would be mad, but obviously he's good, you know what I'm saying? But at the same time.
SPEAKER_03So how did you how did you approach that rest? How do you make that rest or a year? How did you approach it? Did you approach it with you approach it with a chip on your shoulder?
SPEAKER_02Did you approach it with uh Yeah, yeah, you know how it is? It was uh it was when it was like, yeah, I'm gonna I'm about to go crazy. Like I'm gonna make sure like I come back, I'm gonna be more ready than ever. Like, you know what I'm saying? I'm gonna be so ready, like it's not even gonna be possible. Like, like Coach's gonna be like, yeah, we gotta just, we gotta play this guy. Like, and we're gonna give him. And that's what happened. You know, I was throwing the quarterback, you know, all season. I didn't go home, you know what I'm saying? All the other kids just go home. Like I stay up to school. Um, I said really have the money to go home, you know what I'm saying? So I stayed at school at the for the most part. Um, and with the quarterback, you know, we became you know really good friends. And you know, we just had that good connection. And she by the time we got to the game and it was our time to do it, it was over with.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Well, well, Rich, you you end up you end up making a stellar name for yourself there at middle of Tennessee State. Um, you know, you're the go-to guy, and you put yourself in a position to get drafted. And now you're sitting here, you're you're at draft time, um, you end up getting drafted in the seventh round, you hear your name call, you're almost the last pick, man, and like, you know, and your name, in your name get called. What was that moment like for you? Um, you know, I'm and I'm thinking about it because I had a guest on yesterday, um, and that was one of his things, is that you know, one of his biggest, you know, regrets or feelings was not being not hearing his name called. What was that moment like for you?
SPEAKER_02Well, it was nerve-wrecking for me anyways, because um when I initially came out, I was getting told that I was gonna have, you know, a different grade than what I got drafted. So it was like one of those things, like, man, I didn't know I was gonna draft it here. But um just to hear my name call in general, I was like, all right, it's time to go. Like, you know what I'm saying? I'm not I ain't wasting no time, you know what I'm saying? That was my mindset. I'm not wasting no time. I got I'm trying, I'm drafted late. And I didn't know like at the time, like getting drafted late, what that really entailed. You know what I'm saying? I really had no clear idea of like how hard it is to be a guy drafted late, you know what I'm saying? Until I got there, I'm like, oh you gotta work crazy hard. Like, God, I'm used to getting everything right. I'm used to being that guy, I'm used to being, oh my god.
SPEAKER_03All right, so what's now you're in the NFL and now you realize as a seven-round draft, uh, seven-round draft pick, man, I gotta, I gotta work. So how did you approach that? Did was it a chip or was it all right, I gotta go get this bag?
SPEAKER_02What well it was more like a I didn't think about the money. Like it's again, like even when I like even when I like got there, like it was more so like I love football so much, like I didn't know what how the the money worked. I didn't know nothing. Like, I was just like, I love football so much, like I just want to play football, you know what I'm saying? So it was more so like, well, who what what am I doing? Like, am I playing receiver? Like, you know what I'm saying? I didn't have no clue. Like, and obviously I'm playing receiver, I got dropped as receiver, but it's like I've heard that I'm gonna just be a returner, like which I did return, but I wasn't like somebody that that was my main focus in college, you know what I'm saying? I did it to kind of always get the ball in my hands, and you know, there was another touch for me, pretty much. So I had a, you know, had a little, you know, I can do it a little bit, you know what I'm saying? Um, so when I got there, yeah, it was that chip of it was that chip of like, hey man, I'm just trying to be on this field. Like, I don't know what I need to do, but give me a playbook. Um, I'm gonna be in that playbook as much as I can. Like, I know it's a new system. Like I know I'm I'm in the NFL now, but it's still football. But just give me the playbook and I'm just trying to learn as much as I can how much I can learn. And you know what I'm saying? Just get me on the field. That's all I'm trying to do is get on the field.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, absolutely. I appreciate your answer in that way, man. I because, you know, again, when we're in this era where, you know, money is everywhere, and I think we forget to chase the game, and just hearing the love for the love that you have for the game, you wasn't even caring about any of that stuff. It's like that stuff is gonna come. And, you know, because if you keep it the main thing, the main thing, then the the other ancillary things that come along with the game is gonna be there for you. Uh so it makes me think, in that position of like, all right, I gotta get out here, I gotta get on this field, give me the playbook. You know, as a seven-round draft pick, what did you feel like you had to prove right off the bat?
SPEAKER_02I can play. That's Peter Quinn. But can you play? And to be honest with you, like perfecting the game and perfecting a crowd, that was the hardest part, you know, transitioning from college to the NFL for me because I didn't have a receiver coach. And one uh I had a receiver coach, but you know, things didn't work out, and and plus it was only for a year. And you know, we you don't really have the time as a receiver coach in college to actually teach someone how to do something, especially you know, throughout the year and you know, whatever. But so I didn't learn the game of the football of receiver football, like just being a receiver, a pre-receiver until I got to the NFL. So like proving that I can play was the main thing. Can you play a receiver? Like, you know what I'm saying? Because being a running back or you know, being a quarterback, um, that was something I did for the most small part in all my life, and I can adjust to that, at least the running back part of it. You know, I ain't gonna say I'm a quarterback out here, but like um just playing receiver, just the hardest part is like, can you play the game?
SPEAKER_03Well, you you have a lot you have a lot of dynamic going on there in your in your um in your experience, playing running back, playing, you know, uh, you know, punt return or kick turn. You're doing all these different things. And so being able to just finally get to a place where you can focus on a couple things uh is a huge, is a huge change for you. And now you get a chance to do that and get actually get the right coaching to you know to excel at that position, then you do. You know, so when I think about, you know, um, you know, being a seven-round draft pick, you know, what what what separates what separates guys like you know who are late-round draft picks uh from the guys who actually stay stick around or the guys who actually you know put most likely disappear when they get drafted that uh late in that round.
SPEAKER_02Well, to be honest with you, like I I um just the work, you know what I'm saying, you put in, to be honest with you, and just being healthy. And then, you know, taking in that knowledge from the older guys that's done it. That I think that you know that helps and just being cultural, not just from the coaches, but from the people that have done it. You know what I'm saying? I wouldn't I wouldn't scare to ask questions, learning the game and soaking it up as much as I can.
SPEAKER_03You know, I'm I'm glad you said that because I I I have a question around that is you know, I talk to a lot of kids now, you know, in high school and in, you know, most a lot of different positions. And, you know, I asked them who are they watching to get better? You know, uh are they watching their peers? Are they watching, you know, guys at the college level or the pro level? And it's always kind of like, oh, just a guy at the pro level. And I and I asked a question like, do you think you can learn something from some of your teammates, some of the guys that are that are around you that can help you excel your game? Um and this and this this generation is not really thinking about how do I look at the people around me as well as someone who plays at the next level, because there is a progression to it. So just to jump to look at a guy at the pro level at high school, yes, that's the model that I want to be. But now how do I get myself systematically in a progression to get there? Um, you know, what's your advice for young athletes to, you know, start thinking about making sure that they're not just looking at that, the the elite, but also what can I take from someone around me from their game that I can add to my game to keep improving that I don't do well?
SPEAKER_02Well, take your time. First of all, it's it's a reason why we're in the league. You know what I'm saying? Like it's a lot of stuff that comes with the game. Yeah, and it's a game within the game. So as you get older or you know, you start out playing, like the game is very slow. But it gets faster as you get to the next level and it gets faster. So just take your time, focus on you know, getting the proper footwork. Like all these kids want to do, you know, do the fancy, you know what I'm saying? You know what I'm saying? Instead of just getting the basic footwork down, you know what I'm saying? Like, you know, just like you know, whatever, how you get your release, you know what I'm saying, wherever that is. Uh you know, just getting that basic fundamental stuff down first, and and then you start adding on to your game and you know, putting more to your bag and all that stuff because at the end of the day, it was like some of these kids don't even know when like to catch the ball their shoulder or whether to turn around and jump. Like, you know what I'm saying? That timing of when to just block a defender out instead of trying to, you know. Not the kids trying to do what they doing ahead, whatever they do, you know what I'm saying? So it's like the game has changed now, you know, a lot. But it's they want to jump to the conclusion, you know what I'm saying? Instead of just taking it, yeah, like instead of just taking it one step at a time. And you can learn from your teammates. Um I think that's the best way to learn, especially like when you're in like a group setting, and you know, you were, you know, especially in the practice, you know, like hey, coach talking to him, but I heard what coach said, I'm gonna try to do something totally opposite or a little bit better. You know what I'm saying? Like, right, that's that's how you one, you you compete with yourself, right? You should compete with other guys too, without not necessarily telling you to compete with them, but like that's how you learn it, right? You know what I'm saying? Then you you telling them, like, hey bro, like hey, that's what coach said, like, you know what I'm saying? Or I I peep where you know what happened over here, like because I ain't stingy with the game, I'll tell you what's going on.
SPEAKER_03Exactly.
SPEAKER_02You know what I'm saying? I'm never gonna be stingy, I'll tell you how to, you know, how to get it, you know what I'm saying? I'm not gonna be like, oh yeah, I'm just gonna take my spot. I ain't gonna I ain't gonna do that stingy guy, you know, swear to the Lord. Hey, I'm learning too, bro. We all learn, we in this together. We at the end of there, we all trying to win, right? Yeah, we're trying to win the game, get to the Super Bowl, you know, you know, and win it, you know.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, which you did, which you did. We we're gonna talk about that. But uh so so so Richie, um I've never, I mean, I'm a I'm a line and I've never had to stand back there and look up and catch a punt with somebody bearing down on me. You know, what take me through that. What's what's that mental demand where you, you know, returning kicks, you gotta you gotta feel the ball and then be able to look down and make a move and make sure you secure the ball. Like, you know, what is that mental gymnastics like?
SPEAKER_02Uh I tell you, no, there's a lot going on back there. There's a lot going on, it's a lot to think about back there. Uh not on a on a serious note, uh, it's something that like honestly, I I I like doing it. It wasn't my favorite thing to do, but that's what that's why I was that's how I stayed on the field, so I had to do it. Um and you know, I just made something out of it. Um and try to, it's the only thing about it is just the what makes it hard is if you you really can't mess up. Like that's the only position on the field where you can't really mess up. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03But yeah, so so so even just that though, right there, man. Like, how do you prepare knowing that one mistake could change the whole game?
SPEAKER_02The whole game. Field position, uh, muff punt, like any one little change the whole game. Um it can mess you up, you know, like as a person. Like now that you uh, you know, as a the next game, if you still gotta go back there and do it again, like and you're front and it just happened. You you seen it on film, you seen it on TV, you seen it, you've seen it everywhere. Right. Now you gotta go back there and do it again. Don't let you, you know what I'm saying? Don't let you gotta do it in the same game. Like I, you know, like it's it's hard. You know, I would say like for me, I've done it, you know, I've muffed two punts in the game before. And it happened, I muff two punts. I'd I I've muffed one and then I'll I think or two phones in the game, I would say. I forgot what happened, but that's this thing. You try to blank it out as much as you can. Um but yeah, like yeah, you know, it's just it happens and it's it's a hard job. I'm gonna lie to you. It's one of those things where you know, I see anybody that does it, uh, it's one of the hardest things as far as like you gotta catch the point, first of all. That's the more thing, catch the ball. That's that's the more thing catch the ball. But just tracking the ball, you know, being there, um, and knowing who is in front of you, knowing what, you know, where you're not supposed to go, where the trap is gonna be at. Um shoot, you know, who's that guy on that, that who's that gunner on the team that's like a demon that is that's just he's gonna always be down the field right in your face by the time you catch it. So it's just like you put three people on him, he yeah, he's not gonna he's gonna be there, yeah, which is another job that I don't I see with anybody that does.
SPEAKER_03Um but um yeah, man, it's just are you are you back there like just not thinking, or are you back there using tools where you're breathing, you're taking deep breaths, you're like talking to yourself. Um yeah, because I I could imagine like how do you keep that anxiety down when when when you know it it does a lot on the line?
SPEAKER_02Well, to be honest with you, I just I try not to think until the ball's in the air. Mean like I'm back there, probably I'm looking around, all right, yeah, we back here. Like we on the field, like dang, I'm shoot, I'm in this another game. Like, this is crazy. Like, I'm on TV again, like living out a kid's dream, trying to be a kid again. Like, you know, just trying to relive that moment, like, dang, like, I'm out here, you know what I'm saying? Like, but then I get the ball, you know, I get serious when I try to lock in as much as I can when I get, you know, the ball's kicked, and you're like, all right, what we need to do. Yeah, I need to get how many yards, like, all right, where are we, you know, where are we going? I, you know what I'm saying? What, you know, whatever. So yeah. I do a little breathing a little bit, but you it gets serious back there. I would say it just gets serious, it gets real.
SPEAKER_03Absolutely, absolutely. Well, Richie, uh, no, no, that's great, man. We're gonna take a quick little two-minute segment here. I like to do a little quick rep rapid fire two-minute before take that two minute going into halftime. So I'm gonna hit you with some rapid fire questions. So don't think, just let it rip. All right, you ready for this? All right. Um, the hardest stadium you've you've had to play in.
SPEAKER_02You know what? I'm gonna give it to you guys back there. I'm gonna give it to Seattle.
unknownYeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02They got my number. They got my number. I ain't gonna lie to you. That's the only thing. They got my number, but I do, I broke that curse. Like, you know, I always said that I broke that curse. Um, you know, I won't get into that anytime you want to. So, but yeah, yeah, my number.
SPEAKER_03Uh, all right. Best defensive back you face. One of the best defensive back you face.
SPEAKER_02Uh, well, not a lot of action, but just seeing like Jason Verrett and Richard Sherman of War's in practice.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02You know, it's hard. It's hard to, you know, seeing that. But in college, I played against Javier's war. You know what I'm saying? It's like I've it's more in practice that I've seen I've been on teams where like the best defensive players that you know, Snee and McDuck, you know what I'm saying? Like, I've been on teams where I'm I'm seeing them, you know, versus Ashley playing against a live action, because usually I'm not on the outside. Right. Um you know, so using a slot and I don't really see too many slots like that. That's I mean, there's some good slots, don't get me wrong. I'm not like, you know, but like I see, you know, I see some guys, K Wan, you know, K Wan Williams, like you know, I see some guys over the years.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, that's what's up. All right, um, one lesson, one lesson that you learn with um the 49ers are the Chiefs that taught you about winning.
SPEAKER_02That's a good one. Um the most selfish you gotta be selfless. That's that's the one right word I'm looking for it. Like you gotta be, yeah, you gotta be like, you can't be I. You know what I'm saying? Like the only way you're gonna win this game is like you gotta put your body, you gotta put your body in the line for the next guy. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Uh, you know, just being a block, especially blocking in San Francisco. Like, that's the only way you're gonna get the ball, to be honest with you. Like, if you ain't blocking, you might not be on the field. You know what I'm saying? So you gotta be a good blocker. Like, you know what I'm saying? So I would say just being the, you know, being that type of guy that just you can't be all about you, you know what I'm saying?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, hey, I'm cutting this, I'm cutting this clip and I'm sending it right to my son. I tell him all the time, he plays receiver. Hey man, you're not touching the field unless you can block at the next level. So just get your mind right. That's it.
SPEAKER_02That's serious, man. You gotta take blocking serious, man. Like, especially you don't want to get your you don't want to get you don't want to be the guy that the corners, you know, makes a tackle, you know, or the safety or makes a tackle on the running back and when it could be a home run, you know. Right, right. Like I see the meeting room that is like, dang, man. LB, man, I just got that block and not coach look at your life.
SPEAKER_03All right. Um, what did the Giants season in 2022 teach you about your confidence?
SPEAKER_02Well, it talked me, I know I can play. It's just the thing about it is situational. I just believe truly, like in situation, you give somebody a hundred catch or a hundred you know targets a year, he can do something with it. You know what I'm saying? Like you be, you know, you get hot. It's like a basketball player, you get hot, you know. It's like you get a feel for the game again. That you're in the league for a reason. You know, uh, I was good in college. I got a hundred catches a year at one point. So it's just you give me a hundred targets, I will make it do what they do. Yeah, yeah, I can I can do something. And um, you know, I can do it. You know what I'm saying? That's what I taught me. I can do it, you know what I'm saying?
SPEAKER_03That's all they taught me. Most dependable position on the field.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Uh yeah, like just give me ball, I can do it.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. All right. Um, give me one veteran that you've that you've been around that helped you early in your career, extend your career.
SPEAKER_02Um, I would say Pierre Garcon. All right. I'll say Pierre Garcon.
SPEAKER_03All right, last one for you. Um, one habit that kept you in the league.
SPEAKER_02Eating right.
SPEAKER_03Taking care of that body, man. Eating right. I ain't gonna lie to you.
SPEAKER_02That body, man. Just the fact like I started feeling a difference when I ate right for a long time and then I ate like, you know, crap, you know, the next day. Or, you know what I'm saying, one day, and then the next day I feel like, dang, man, I kind of feel a little different, like, but you notice the food, like, you know what I'm saying? It's like, dang.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. The go-go juice.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_03All right, man. I appreciate though. Those are awesome, man. We're gonna jump back in. Um, you know, we got several more questions for you, but you know, you when you start thinking about that, that the end of your career, um, you go out on a high note, man. You in your career as a Super Bowl champ with the Kansas City Chiefs. You know, take us through that experience. And and did you think that it was, did you think that was it for you, uh, you know, once that, once that curtain closed?
SPEAKER_02Um, nah, it's a lot of it's that's like a a whole conversation within itself, as far as like um I had my mind, I want to play 10 years. You know, but unfortunately.
SPEAKER_03Just a magic number.
SPEAKER_02My knee. Yeah, my knee just never um it never it just never healed correctly. And I just was fighting it for some years. And, you know, that 2023 season shot the Chiefs for giving me a chance to even, you know, be on an elite roster.
SPEAKER_03It's a crazy dichotomy, man. Like that that competitor inside you, it's like, you know, uh, I'm happy for for this, but this competitor piece of it, it's like, I mean, I I want to be make sure that I'm contributing to this as well. So yeah, like so I get that guy. I get that.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, like I'm just I was just on that team, you know what I'm saying? Like, yeah, and obviously I feel like I had a lot to do with why I wasn't getting the ball early on, anyways, because I didn't they like I was still hurt, you know what I'm saying? Yeah, I I think they they knew that um in their head, but I just I was still hurt, you know like just plain hurt, you know, and sadly that's how the game goes. I never see my surf out there, I got hurt, and I'm just trying to hold on as long as long as I can, and and I and I did it.
SPEAKER_04Sometimes the way sometimes the way it's crumble. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02And I won the biggest, and I won the biggest one. Uh and I I never won a bigger one, you know. So I never won a championship game in my life. You feel me? So it's just like they ain't like it took me all these years, 20 some years in playing football, never got to win a real big game, and never got to be in the big game, and I never been in the biggest game, and when you know, I had a chance to yeah.
SPEAKER_03So what what what was that? What was the Chiefs' culture like? Uh, you know, what what made them so different there?
SPEAKER_02Hey man, anybody that goes and plays for the Chiefs for a whole year, it starts off it start off in like it started off right off the bat. Like, I'm talking about real deal work, like it's real deal Holy feel. Like, it's it feels like college in a sense, like that old shoe crime, like you go into training camp, like you are you standing caught, you stand in college dorms, you know what I'm saying? So it's just like you it's getting it feels like real muddy, like real uh like real gritty out there, like you know what I'm saying? So it's like dang, like we are in 110 degree weather and full pads, and we getting in like and it's long days, and you know what I'm saying, and it's back to fact that. So I think just that work of just like everybody wants to be the best and everybody wants to compete. And right it's a lot of talking going on, to be honest with you. Like, what are you talking about? I ain't gonna lie to you, they want to do a lot of talking and a lot of like, you know, hey bro, like I'm about to get on you, you feel me?
SPEAKER_03It's a grind, man. It's a grind. Well, man, you you walk away from the game at you know, 29 years old with the knee injury, and you know, I you know, we talk about this a lot on the show, um, the transition, you know, how was the transition for you? You know, was you at peace with your decision to walk away from the game? Um, but then also, you know, what was the the anxiety or the or or or maybe peace was like stepping over into the new arena, this the arena called life, um, you know, the the the real world, so as as they say.
SPEAKER_02Um, to be honest with you, like it took me a while to adjust. I'm like a lot to you. Like, um, because that's all I did. I never had a job. You know, football's my only job. Um, so like I didn't know what it was like outside of football. You know what I'm saying? So for me, like that that transition was more so like, hey, what is who am I outside of football anyways? You know what I'm saying? Like, I never got to figure that person out because I was so locked in with football. Like even, you know, offseason, like you get a month off, but that's not enough to you know, figure out who you know what I'm saying, who you are as a person. And it's hard to kind of balance up, you know, life in football when that's all I know. You know what I'm saying? That's all I know. And so I don't know how I'm able to even mentally you know be here, don't crash out, to be honest with you, because I didn't have that guidance, but I just kind of took on the pieces and stuff I learned from you know guys that are in the league, you know what I'm saying? That hey bro, this is what happens after you know after football. Like I heard, and they probably heard that from the guys before them, you know what I'm saying? Like, or you know, even have the conversation with old hands that that walk around the building sometimes that play the game for a long, long time and come back and help teams. And it's like, hey man, it's different outside of football. You're done with football, but you ain't done. Like you you done you physically, you can't go out there and do it. You know, the coaches ain't nobody calling you no more, you know what I'm saying? But you ain't done. You know what I'm saying? I'm like, dang, like, I mean, for a whole year and a half, like I was having sweats, you know what I'm saying? I wake up and go like why I just plays amazing. I made a crazy catch. You know what I'm saying? Like, you know, like just like just like thinking I'm you know, just waking up, like I'm having that, I gotta go to treatment at 6 30. You know what I'm saying? Like, I gotta get up and so it's like adjusting to that. Oh, I can sleep into eight, nine. Man, that's hard. I can't do it. I still can't do it to this day. I can't sleep that long. You know what I'm saying? Like, I'm always I I just get up and like, nah, I really can't sleep long anyway. It's my daughter, I got a daughter, I got two kids, so I really can't sleep long anyway.
SPEAKER_03So no, dad, let's go, let's go, let's go time.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, so boy, what? So the sun come up, boy. A little bit, a little peek is over with. Um, but just that adjustment outside of football, it's like I'm still in that process, basically.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah, yeah. Are you are you uh we talk about this in in the sense of that foundation from football, being able to carry it over in the transition. What do you think football has given you um that is starting to help you rebuild your foundation into this new arena?
SPEAKER_02Um just the discipline part of it, as far as like just been on time with just the littler stuff, like you know, my daughter, my daughter's appointment, my appointments, and you know, trying to be, you know, instill that in my my kids. Um like, well, obviously they're one and four, so it's hard to, you know, really place like, hey, you know, I'm starting, I'm trying to start young, like I'm gonna be now, yeah. But anyways, yeah, um, I think it just carries off the field too. Yeah, um, you know, especially when you be talking to people, just how you talk to people, um, you know, how you carry yourself. Um, because you are your, you know, you are well, I've been taught, um, you are your own business. So you know, just how you handle yourself, how you manage, you know, talking to anybody, shaking hands with people, and just you know, connecting with people. Um, that's what football is all about too, you know, just making that connection with people too.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Well, man, I know the transition not hard, and I hear that you're you're still working toward trying to figure out what that what that piece looked like for you. Always know that you got a resource here with me. Um, got a great network of you know, former guys and you know, people that have surrounded us outside of the game that that you know could be a resource for you in that, because I know it's not easy. Um, but like you said, there's a foundation there, there's a discipline, there's the things that you've learned that it carries carries over, and that's those pieces, the important pieces for us to make sure that we also realize those intangibles. And so with that, you know, if you can go back to your seven-round draft pick moment, you know, when the league was just the beginning of things, you know, uh, what would you say to your younger self to help you understand the journey that you were about to embark on?
SPEAKER_02When it said don't put all your eggs in one basket, you know what I'm saying? I know I didn't have no other baskets. So like I had this one, that's all I had to do, you know what I'm saying? But I could have created more relationships um with the right people. Um and and actually like uh you know, water those relationships at this point, and I just you know planned the seeds and that was it. You know what I'm saying? Like, hey man, I'm here or you here, whatever. I would definitely tell myself, like, hey, make sure you have that plan in place of what are you gonna do? What are you gonna do when it's all said and done? Like, because at the end of the day, this it doesn't last long. You hear it, but you as a kid or as a young one, you like, man.
SPEAKER_03You know, thinking about that.
SPEAKER_02I've been playing football for so long, bro. Like, my body can hold up, like, man, I'm not worried about this. Yeah, like these dudes lasted two, three, two, one, you know what I'm saying? Like you're talking about, oh these dudes ain't last that long. But you realize, like, nah, bro, like you've been playing for that long. That's how long your body's getting beat up. So you gotta think about it. You ain't got that much longer.
SPEAKER_04Right, right, right.
SPEAKER_02You're gonna get older, like you're gonna slow down just a little bit, my brother. Like, you're gonna, you might be athletic all your life, but you're gonna slow down. Like, and I didn't realize that, you know. So I would tell myself, definitely, yeah, man. Hey, one, take care of your body too. Um, like it's the like the resources are there, use them, you know, start early and you know, get a head start, man. I can I ask you a few questions before you dip on. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, then so you you um you say you played too, huh? I see you had Seattle back there.
SPEAKER_03So played for 10 years. Um drafted. I was uh Seattle's first round in 05, played there for six years and went to Chicago for two, and then I finished my career with the Tennessee Titans. I think I got a couple of those still back there, yeah. Um I'm old, man. Were you in Seattle? I was in Seattle from 05 to 2010, so I played six seasons there.
SPEAKER_01So you just played with Alexander?
SPEAKER_03Yep, John Alexander, Matt Houseback, Walter Jones, Steve Hutchinson.
SPEAKER_01That was my favorite running back of all time. And then like SA, man. L T just L T just came and took over my life.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, man. Yeah, SA had, man, LA, I you know, I I've never been around a running back, you know, up until that uh playing with him that had uh unbelievable field vision. Man, his field vision was like gosh, man. Some of the things I'm you sitting here watching, you're like, Man, I how did he see that? And so Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02He was he was Man, that's crazy. First round. So you well you're you're based in Tennessee now, huh?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, here in Nashville. Uh been here. I when I finished my career career with the Titans, I decided to stay here. Yeah. And uh Hey man, hey Nashville's that's not a bad place.
SPEAKER_02It's grown, man.
SPEAKER_03Growing like crazy. Got three kids, you know, they all playing sports. Okay. You got a 15, a 16-year-old, a 14-year-old, and a 13-year-old. And man, it's busy. Life is busy.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, life is busy. You got the podcast going, yeah, a lot going on right now.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah, work. I got a technology company. Uh, that's what we do with our technology platform. We analyze people's language and build personality behavior profiles. And it's again leaning in into those intangibles that that we got the chance to develop, you know, based off how we grew up. And now this younger generation don't have that. And so using our technology platform to meet them where they are, and you know, they're behind their screen anyway. So let's let's show them where they are with these different tangibles like coachability, character, leadership, composure, the communication style, their thinking style, show them how to improve, things to watch out for, how does that show up in a team dynamic? And so that they can then have a uh, you know, starting their new foundation early. So that when they get done, not like me, when I got done, I was like, man, who am I? What do I do? How do I, how do I do this? Uh, and then learning that, oh, the things that has kind of carried me over into entrepreneur and doing the work that I do now is has been those intangibles. And and, you know, man, okay, I know in my leadership skill, I was a center. So uh center had to know everybody's position, had to be the communicator, had to be the, you know, the the glue to the, you know, to the to the line. And so, okay, I got a strong foundation there. Okay, well, even, you know, as an offensive lineman from a composure standpoint, I had to keep my composure, you know, and and not just go go off the rails. And so then so then, you know, then my thinking style, you know, like, okay, entrepreneur works for me because again, playing center, I had to see all these different safeties moving, the line moving the linebackers, and now I can see things in a puzzle and move things around and and problem solve, you know. And so, um, so started leaning to learning about what my intangibles were and looking at my foundation. I was like, oh, shucks, okay, I'm prepared to do this. So now when it was time for me to take that leap and that faith, the leap of faith into, you know, entrepreneurship, um I I had to I re had to rebuild that that identity around those those uh intangibles so that now I there's gonna be challenges hard, it's not it's not easy. Um but now I had that piece that I can like stand on and say, okay, I know I can get to the other side of it. And so uh so that's why all this stuff is important to me because I had to go through it and and now I'm in a place where it's you know, I'm I'm thankful for that, I'm thankful for the the those hard times and the challenges. I'm thankful for going to learn it, but I'm also I'm also at that place where man, I want someone else to learn this early before it's too late. Um and again, it's never too late, but I don't want you to feel, I don't want people to feel that pressure like I felt, you know, if I just eat you know starting it early. So that's that's what we spend a lot of time doing, man. It's just trying to make sure that's good, you know, give back it's the right space. So yeah.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, it's the right thing though. I mean, like you're saying, it's just one of those spaces where like like a lot of it's the guidance that a lot of these kids aren't receiving.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_02You know what I'm saying? They're not receiving the right guidance, you know, and that's where it's it's hard, especially if we got some of the athletes. A lot of kids want to be athletes still too bad. Right. You don't get a lot of I want to be doctors no more, or I want to grow up a lot of kids want to be athletes now.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_02You know what I'm saying?
SPEAKER_03So and and it's not, and it's not um, you know, it's not a lack of guidance in the sense that you know people don't want, parents don't want, or you know, people who are guiding kids don't want. It's the lack of exposure, the lack of experience. Like we get to do this because we get to talk about this because we we lived it, we experienced it. We know that we know the deep internal struggles that we have on the on the onset of you know, leaving the league, knowing that your mind is still there, but your body's like, uh-uh, can't go no more. Um, and then knowing that, that, that those feelings of loneliness and all that that sets in as you as you do make that, that loneliness feeling, even when you're in the game and you're injured and you can't, you know, contribute to your team, you know, we've we experience it, so we get to speak from that place versus someone who is speaking from it who's never experienced it, it just it just hit different, you know, coming coming from us. And so uh so that's why even this podcast, man, I really appreciate you jumping on sharing because it's so important to hear from people who lived it and and not just not just someone who always had it figured out, you know, but you know, we grew up grew up in the projects, you know. I grew up in the projects, and you know, and now you you know, you also now become that beacon of light for others that you know they get to look at someone who didn't have it all figured out, didn't have the you know, the nicety, nice things, but they still figured out that they they didn't allow their circumstances to to hold them back. And so um so it's a it's a lot buried into that, into this whole this whole process.
SPEAKER_02So it's funny you say like circumstances being like held back because like um and that just like hit my brain so crazy because like just growing from the projects, like and having like knowing that it's kind of most kids or most people don't make it out and having that mindset, like you get told that sometimes you get told that, right? You ain't gonna be nothing when you get for whatever season. It's like damn, that's crazy. Yeah, and I've sadly enough, I've had that experience in the NFL like where folks told me that you I don't know how you made the team, you know what I'm saying?
SPEAKER_03So it's like yeah, I mean, yeah, I mean it's it's even it's even on the other side of it. Um, because when I started my technology company, I had a coach that I knew and I respected a lot that it you know he said to me, he's like, Oh, I didn't realize you were that smart. And I was just like, Wow, okay, oh man, you know, and so so it's not just you know the people that's around you in in the in the projects, this is even the people that you've you know broken bones and played through injuries and you know, and and and perform well for, and then they still like um you don't you you got a psychology company that does take it's a technology company that's blended psychology to look at people's personality, being on language models like, well, I didn't realize you was that smart. I'm like, oh, okay, all right. So yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00It's not for you. Hey, it's not for you, brother. Yeah, okay, but I appreciate it though, man.
SPEAKER_03Well, Richard, man, this has been awesome. I got one more question for you as I wrap up question. When you look back over your life, how you grew up, you know, chasing trains and jumping trains and riding bikes and you know, making your way to middle of Tennessee middle Tennessee state, um, making your way to the NFL, and now making that transition to real life with, you know, uh two daughters, I mean two two kids, um, what are those intangibles that you can look back and say, these are these are some of my foundational intangibles that's made me who I am today?
SPEAKER_02I think if you listen well enough and you just you keep your eyes peeled and you keep your head straight, I think everything you need to know about the direction you head is literally around you. I think everything you every sign is there. Um listen to the right people that especially they've done it before. Um just just make sure you keep your ears up, man. You got two ears for a reason. Just listen. I think just listening is the most important thing you can possibly do as an athlete.
SPEAKER_03Well, that's Rich, Richie, man. Your awareness sounds like is is one of those things that's propelled you throughout your career. Um, and being able to hear and listen to you know what you need to soak up to to continue to perform at an elite level. Man, I really appreciate your perspective, the way you embrace the roles that you've been, you know, blessed to be able to do. Uh, and now making that that transition into real life, man. We're rooting for you. Really appreciate you jumping on, sharing your story. Hopefully, someone hears this, uh, maybe one, who knows? Um, here hear some of the struggles and here's some of the the wins that has gone on in your in your uh journey that could help them, man. So we really appreciate you. This has been awesome.
SPEAKER_02No, hey, I appreciate you, Chris.
